Philly Pulls Controversial Black Gay Ads

David
August 8 2006, 9:57AM

I don't think I agree with the perception these folks got of the ads. We spend so much time talking about violence against black bodies, and black male bodies that the ads seem to suggest that we ought to be as concerned about AIDS as we are about physical violence in the black community. Now your concerns about process are important, Keith, but from a substantive standpoint, I do not get the argument being made by Philadelphia's black, gay activists. This may sound like black, gay Uncle Tommin' but sometimes we have to take our victories where we can get them, and fight the next battle the next time. And a city being concerned about black men with HIV/AIDS is a victory.

Mason
August 8 2006, 12:53PM

As a Black Gay Female living in Philly, I find it interesting that I haven't heard about this conflict before. Similarly to what you stated,Keith and David, I do not find these ads to be offensive. When we allow ourselves and our lovers to go unchecked we are committing violence against our bodies. These ads are not promoting violence, but using easily accessible imagery to catch our attention to a very real danger. So, I am having a hard time finding a problem with one of very few ad campaigns targeting Black Gays in Philly. Just as you were saying that the advertisment company was not listening to Black MSM's here, I feel that maybe these activist groups haven't listened all the way either. I feel that if you polled the Black Gay population here, a majority would not have a problem with this campaign. Also, when some were deciding to go against these ads, did they also share any campaign ideas that would be just as effective? I feel that out of all the battles we need to fight this may be a frivilous one.

Dwight Powell / Clik
August 8 2006, 12:54PM

Sorry Keith but this is absolutely ridiculous. THIS IS AN AWESOME CAMPAIGN. It’s on point and does not promote violence. The message is clear and to the “point”: don’t be victims – If you have been “hit”, get tested so that you don’t “hit” someone else. It’s sad that this campaign will not be utilized. I THINK THAT IT’S EXTREMELY POWERFUL and sends a strong message. I can’t understand why Lee Carson and those that support this action does not get the “point”. This is the type of to the point, in your face campaign that’s need for our youth. None of the other softer campaigns are working.

Claude Wynne
August 8 2006, 1:23PM

We have a similar campaign here in San Franicsco by the Health Department aimed at black men called HomoBoy with the slogan "Don't Be a Bitch. Use a Condom!" which I find offensive on many levels. David is right that it is good that cities are concerneed about black men but putting down women and/or bottoms is not the way. Why not just say "Respect Yourself", which is really the point.

Charles
August 8 2006, 1:48PM

I agree with you David in that the message needed to still get out there...nothing is ever going to 100% with all groups of people...

Question: Did another ad campaign replace this one?

Robert K. Burns
August 8 2006, 2:52PM

Hmmm,

While I read the responses from Dwight, Mason and David, I grow increasingly concerned at how you all may view this campaign as a great thing for Philadelphia's Black Gay Mens community.

As a black gay man in Philadelphia, a HIV Prevention Specialist, experienced in provision of HIV prevention for Black Gay men, and most importantly, member and treasurer of Philadelphia's Black Gay Men's Leadership Council, how could we even have the audicity to applaud a message like this when: (1) violence is so rampant in this city amongst Black Men, (2) not even, one week ago a young Black Man (19) was murdered, and (3) why do we continue to think messages that celebrates victimization is alright in our community.

Whats even more important are the impact that fatalism, stigma, and stripping away someones sense of empowerment. We are more than 20 years into this epidemic, I know we can do better than this.

cmoney
August 8 2006, 3:16PM

I get a crummy feeling from that imagery. Maybe it is effective in getting the "target" audience's attention (pun intended), but it looks like something designed by a White Supremacist or Neo-Nazi. I don't like seeing Black men in cross hairs. A sick and dying man in a hospital, a mother crying at his side or a funeral scene with a young man in the coffin would convey the same tragic, urgent message without suggesting violence.

Robert K. Burns
August 8 2006, 3:35PM

Very often the way providers use messages about infection and impact of HIV it actually helps MORE black gay men to become infected with the virus. What do I mean? I don’t know about you but when I hear that 46% of the people that look and love like me are HIV positive and they are seen as moving targets, I'm overwhelmed with grief, anger, and hopelessness. These are exactly the kinds of nihilistic emotions that help facilitate the spread of the virus. When black gay men feel as though no matter what they do they're going to eventually end up HIV positive they're much more likely to engage in unsafe sex.

Providers who run around promoting unhealthy and stigmatizing prevention messages shouting "Have you been hit? – because black gay men are HIV positive" without providing any context for the message basically teaches people that it isn’t a question of "IF" their going to contract the virus, but simply "when". That is why it is important for us to always provide context along with how the message.

David
August 8 2006, 3:48PM

But black men ARE in the cross hais of HIV/AIDS. That is precisely the point. It is as dangerous to our survival as any bullet. We may not be "targeted" but we are in danger, and many refuse to acknowledge that fact. I certainly understand the concerns about victimhood, agency and responsibility, but again, I think that we have got to be willing to do a cost-benefit analysis. How long will it take for replacements ads to make it to the streets? Maybe all this controversy is a good thing, as I see that the NYTimes is covering the controversy, so it at least is getting press coverage. It's not at all clear to me that the campaign itself would have ended up on the pages of the NYTimes, so maybe the activists are better marketers than they are letting on.

jazzi
August 8 2006, 4:00PM

I say get over the whole cross hairs thing & just get the message out! Instead of majoring over minors, let's educate. Sometimes there is no nice way to put things. You have to tell it like it is. With us making up the majority of HIV/AIDS cases in this country & us busting caps in each ohters asses on a daily basis, I'd say we are in a cross hair. And we're putting ourselves there for the most part, but that's another can of worms.

People who are violent prone & have no respect for life need no excuse to act. It's not like pulling these ads is going to stop the violence in Philly. These ads just might cause someone to stop & think about the choices they're making. If it saves even a few lives then it's worth it. It beats making an issue out of nothing & creating a problem where there is none. I wonder if the ones who got these ads pulled have a ready, "less offensive" alternative or are they just impeding progress? I swear, political corectness is going to be the death of us all.

Dwight Powell / Clik
August 8 2006, 4:10PM

Hello Robert. The fact that we don’t live in Philly really has nothing to do with this discussion. You’re an HIV specialist and I respect that. For the past 10 years I’ve worked with community base organizations on numerous social marketing campaigns for HIV/AIDS – so like you I am knowledgeable about this area. HIV/AIDS is rampant all over the country. High crime rate, low crime rate, this campaign is effective for HIV/AIDS. The campaign isn’t telling us to go out and shoot someone. In fact, it’s putting a mirror in front of ourselves and showing us what we are doing to each other. I don’t support violence and neither does this campaign. Far too often we fight the wrong battles. This campaign does not belittle gays – it speaks to a reality of what we’re doing to ourselves.

algie
August 8 2006, 4:30PM

i agree with dwight.its time we as black gay men hell black people wake up stop being in denial being homophobic and love from the heart so we can make a change instead of taking steps backwards.its been going on for too long

Dwight Powell / Clik
August 8 2006, 4:44PM

We need to be realist as far as this disease is concerned. More than any other group, Black gay men are in the crosshairs of HIV/AIDS. Some suggest that the imagery is insensitive – but look at the statistic as it relates to this demographic. We are in the crosshairs because of our own doing – there is noting wrong about being reminded of this FACT. It’s not the government or the “white man” that has HIV/AIDS spreading out of control in our communities ANYMORE. We need to take responsibility for our actions and do the responsible things needed to be done to keep our community safe. This campaign highlights this by illustrating this point: if you DECIDED to have unprotected sex, don’t wait to see if you’ve been HIT… Take the test and know for sure.

Kevin Trimell Jones
August 8 2006, 4:58PM

Let me begin with this: I am excited about these conversations. As repeated to members of the Council, the main goal of the campaign was to increase HIV testing for Black MSM who were not regular testers or not tested for HIV in the past. For some of us, it was clear from the beginning that the science and the community input were missing from the campaign. In an attempt to do more than “complain,” members shared their expertise, provided research articles, attended many meetings, and gave several hours to reviewing materials. Despite these efforts, the Council asked that there be an adjustment to the timeline until community input was gathered. Some were told that monies had already been spent, and that the health department "needed" to proceed. The recent call to have the campaign tabled was in response to member's work in communities and people’s reactions.

Robert K. Burns
August 8 2006, 5:10PM

While I understand the scope of folks comments on this, I still believe that "there is more than one way to skin a cat."

Using imagery that points to Black Men as victims of disease is disheartening and discerning, especially when many of the folks, and I will stress MANY, of these same folks are not at the other end of the table when a Black "gay" man comes into an agency, has been "hit" and then feels they have fell victim to the disease. Its much deeper than that. Black men are often faced with messages of hatred for one another, violence, etc. So adding another to the heap doesnt make it any more right. I agree the numbers are staggering. While nationally we are screaming 46%...locally in Philly 27% is none-the-less still UNACCEPTABLE. But should it come at the cost of the continued alienation of Black Men?

test
August 8 2006, 5:41PM

test

Kevin Trimell Jones
August 8 2006, 8:15PM

Even though I have problems with it, I personally believe that this campaign will encourage some people to get tested; some people who are moved by fear-based messages. Yet I don’t believe that this campaign, by itself, will promote testing among those individuals who rarely test or have never tested, which are the campaigns goals. Instead, those with a lower threshold of risks will get tested (which is also important), and the city will sit “comfortably” believing that they’ve designed a campaign that increased testing. It’s only when the city’s newest infections show an AIDS diagnosis within six months that they’ll realize they are wrong before going back to the drawing board; this is what our current data shows. I pray that I am wrong. Nonetheless, we cannot afford this; nor can we continue to “just settle” for social marketing campaigns, and the such…

bmnatty
August 8 2006, 8:42PM

I can understand why the ads would be considered offensive. I wonder if there were any focus groups conducted with the ads prior to their release. Often, things like this are created in a vacuum. Having people from the targeted communities at the drawing table can save time & money.

My bigger question is "are these campaigns really effective"? I am not asking this to be cynical. I'd really like more information about the effectiveness of campaigns. From what I hear, it seems that infection rates are higher and growing. Is that because more people are testing now due to marketing campaigns and the numbers for infections increase with the number of people being tested?

I used to work in the HIV/AIDS education field many years ago. It concerns me that the struggles now seem to be the same just as they were then. A friend of mine believes that it is time for new approaches. Also, are people promoting that the 20 minute HIV test? It's great but I just learned about it. Knowing about this could help.

Mike
August 8 2006, 8:51PM

I can not imagine any other community who would be okay with this type of media. If any of the individuals here decided that they would want to use their own private resources to present such a campaign, I imagine many of you would be okay with it. The fact of the matter is the government used tax payer dollars and resources for the campaign. The public here in Philadelphia clearly spoke out against it and the government removed the campaign.

A useful context here would include further knowledge about other efforts the City is engaged in along with the understanding that in that context this camapign does not fit.

Regardless of whether folks here think the campaign is effective or not, it does present a theme of violence that has caused a distraction here in Philadelphia and has been appropriately acted upon following the actions of a couple of brave Black Gay Men who are by the way leading some very important initiatives here in the local community and should be commended for their work.

saint james
August 8 2006, 9:07PM

Having unprotected sex, whether you are gay, straight, lesbian, transgendered or bi-sexual is like playing russian roulette. GET THE POINT? "Have You Been Hit" is an excellent tag line for this ad.

An old African proverb: "Two men in a burning house do not have time to stop and argue."

Kevin Trimell Jones
August 8 2006, 10:06PM

This campaign cannot be used as a stand alone initiative; an educational piece that explicitly centers HIV on the same stage as gun violence must accompany it and put in neighborhoods. Locally, HIV is often talked about as a “personal” issue, and not a “community issue.” This may be, in part, due to the absence of testing sites, health centers, or free condom distributors in those areas. Residents recognize violence as a real problem, and “protect” themselves against it. This idea is not completely shared when it comes to HIV. In an interview, I recently heard one man say that HIV rates are not high in his neighborhood: he’s “had unprotected sex several times and never got nothing.” He’s 26, and lives in one of Philly’s highest census tracts hit by HIV. So while the campaign has been shelved, it’s not a “victory;” it is a “nice” step in a longer journey. But I’m excited about these conversations and believe they will foster a movement and lifestyle reflected by increased testing and reduced transmissions.

Steve
August 9 2006, 12:08AM

To me that ad looks like it's saying the way to get rid of AIDS is to shoot gay men. Good riddance.

Byron C. Mayes
August 9 2006, 7:58AM

What troubles me about this item, is that Keith takes issue with the process seemingly without any real knowledge about the process, or, for that matter, the community. He writes, "What bothers me is not so much the content of the ads but the process in which they were developed, specifically the apparent failure or unwillingess of government officials to heed the concerns of the leaders in the community."

"Leaders of the community!!?" The Black Gay Men's Leadership Council has zero profile here in Philadelphia. It's a great idea -- Philadelphia is seriously lacking in Black Gay organizations -- but, Keith, we're not talking about Philly's version of GMAD. There's no web site, no phone book entry, no PSAs, and I dare say most gay Black men in the city have never even heard of it. How would one expect ZigZag or the city to consult them?

There is no "leadership" in the Philadelphia Black gay community. There's barely a community. Don't blame the city for not being able to find it.

Robert K. Burns
August 9 2006, 9:02AM

Wow...Byron....what really pains me from your post is the sense of anger I gathered from the tone. Being mindful that the Black Gay Men's Leadership Council (BGMLC) is a new group (not even a year old) we have stepped up to the plate to develop strageties to address some of the plaquing issues in the Black Gay Men's Community here in Philadelphia. Are we Philly's Gay Men of African Descent (GMAD), People of Color in Crisis (POCC), Harlem United, or GMHC...no...with planning, nuturing and a fostered since of community support we can be the organization you claim that is missing from Philly. Addressing the impact of this campaign is simply one of our steps around advocacy, but we are not the end all be all.
Feel free to join us Thursday @ 7pm at 11th/Pine as we address the unjust/brutal murder of a young (19 y/o) Black gay man who was run down and killed over a chain and ring. --RKB

jcampbell
August 9 2006, 10:59AM

This type of advertising offends me for several reasons. Beyond conveying an image of violence of an assassin's bullet, it perpetuates the suggestion that even if one receives a positive diagnosis, it's an automatic death sentence. I dislike that there is even a need for HIV prevention or testing information that must be tailored directly at blacks. Last time I checked, we all die the same. Any message to avoid HIV leaves an impression upon me and alters my behavior; I don't care if Popeye is featured in the ads. On a social aspect, I hate the impression that such ethnically-driven ads may foster the further prejudice that black men are more likely to be infected than our white counterparts. I would hate to have a potential date or sex partner look at me and the first impression he has might be: "Black = HIV."

saint james
August 9 2006, 1:11PM

No, jcambell, blacks do not die the same as others. We are infected and affected at higher rates than others. We have less access to health care and when we do recieve medical attention, blacks are sicker than their white counterparts; hence a shorter life span and quality of life.

There had better be an ad campaign directed at blacks because WE ARE MORE LIKELY TO BE INFECTED. Check the stats!
Good for you that any message about HIV garners your attention and alters YOUR behavior. Would to God that all young blacks, no matter their sexual orientation would do the same. Since that is not happening there needs to be ads directed at the community of folk who are disproportionately affected by HIV.

jcampbell
August 9 2006, 5:10PM

Sorry, Saint James, I have to disagree with your citing statistics as a proven measure of anything. Statistics are subject to interpretation and can be manipulated. Rather than blacks more likely to be infected, I believe it's more accurate to say reporting and measuring and getting blacks into the testing centers may make it seem blacks are more likely to be infected. The rise in REPORTED infection rates may be nothing more than just that; more diligent reporting. I just don't understand the idea that being black makes us any less likely to have a strong instinct to survive. As a people, blacks in America have surmounted poverty, racism, slavery; we ought to be able to confront and rise above HIV.

saint james
August 9 2006, 8:24PM

jcambell:

What we ought to do and what we are actually doing are clearly two different things. How does one skew death statistics? But how can one have a rational argument with you regarding this since you are enitrely emotional in your approach. The statistics are factual. There is nothing manipulated about the fact that the black female presently has the highest instances of new HIV infections. Where are they getting it? Black men!
How would the reporting now be "more diligent"? Was it unreported before? Your concern about your potential dating sources viewing you as black and therefore HIV+ speaks to how emotional your response is to this issue.
What you would hate to happen is truly irrelevant to what is FACTUAL. There is no conspiracy. Black folk are dying and the message is not getting to us as clearly as it is with some others.

G&D
August 10 2006, 10:34AM

From my understanding, this campaign was geared to brothas in the hood that don't think about getting tested and are probably not gay identified. Life in the hood, unfortunately, involves an almost stoic acceptance of gun violence as a way of life. The other day there was a really moving article in the Philadelphia Daily News profiling all of the rituals that have developed by young people in the hood when one of their own is killed. Using this imagery to impress that HIV is as prevelant as gun violence could be very effective for those in the target audience.

Those who are opposed to it tend to be educated professionals who are not in the target audience. Lets be real. There is no monolithic black gay male community. So for the Black Gay Mens Leadership Council to say they speak for the Black SGL community in Philadelphia (with less than a year's time in existence) is a little far fetched. They speak for the sensabilities of their membership, Black, openly gay, educated, middle class men.

mike
August 10 2006, 4:28PM

Some people will "responders" and some will be the "leaders"...if one or two of the folks who see this move to remove the campaign as a bad thing would step up as and join others who have wrongly or rightly taken a stand, perhaps the all that is missng in Philadlephia can be accomplished.

It's both harmful and shameful for anyone to sit behind the security of this vehicle to talk about what others are doing and how one does not represent them, when in fact they state themselves that there is little to nothing going on in Philadelphia to help save the lives of Black gay Men, Black Men on the DL, Black same Gender Loving Men, Black Bi-sexual Men and those Black Men for what ever personal reasons do not identify in any of these areas.

Simply misguided and frankly, it should stop now. You're either for a solution or not. If the latter, you should get out of the way!

Mark McLaurin
August 10 2006, 10:29PM

G&D- How wonderfully elitist of you to speak up for the brothers in the "hood" who apparently can only be reached with an HIV prevention message by analogizing it to something they would REALLY understand like gun violence !

Kudos to PBGMLC- regardless of who you do or dont speak for- you are speaking and you are doing so on behalf of a community that far too often is not heard from at all- Keeu up the good work !

Ive spoken to numerous HIV positive men who resent being demonized and pathologized in the way this campaign does-Have our lives been reduced to a gay paint ball game where I guess the poz guys have guns and we run around trying to not get HIT ????

THIS CAMPAIGN IS OUTRAGEOUS- IM GLAD WE WORKED TOGETHER TO PULL IT DOWN AND ID DO IT AGAIN !

Mike
August 11 2006, 8:27AM

Mark,the brothers in Philly appreciate very much your support and leadership on this issue! You're a soldier!

We need our soldiers!

While some folks may think there isn't anything going on here, there are those of us who know differently because we are a part of what's going on, have been and will be.
Like any place there needs to be more. What we don't need is folks who don't want to be a part of the solution slowing us down or wearing us out.

So join us, don't hate us..if you about saving lives..who knows whose life it will be that's on the line next.....?

We don't have to agree on everything..but SILENCE or No Action=DEATH....far too many have and are dying...it's your time to be counted!

Mike
August 11 2006, 9:00AM

Mark,the brothers in Philly appreciate very much your support and leadership on this issue! You're a soldier!

We need our soldiers!

While some folks may think there isn't anything going on here, there are those of us who know differently because we are a part of what's going on, have been and will be.
Like any place there needs to be more. What we don't need is folks who don't want to be a part of the solution slowing us down or wearing us out.

So join us, don't hate us..if you about saving lives..who knows whose life it will be that's on the line next.....?

We don't have to agree on everything..but SILENCE or No Action=DEATH....far too many have and are dying...it's your time to be counted!

G&D
August 11 2006, 9:43AM

Mark,

How unfortunate that you stoop to calling me names and using your name calling as a reason to blithely dismiss my idea. That is the problem among many who call themselves leaders in this community and country. Any person expressing an idea contrary to their own is demonized, making it easier to dismiss their idea instead of having substantive and brotherly conversation. As brothers, we should be able to disagree without resorting to personal attack. Lets not reduce Same Gender Loving to what is done in the bedroom only.

My idea is that those in the target community, who are of a different culture than the PBGMLC, approved the ad series. My idea is that ad campaigns with middle class, PC values have not worked in the hood. That is not to say that the PBGMLC is wrong. But merely to say that we must think outside the box, take risks, and consider the impact of diversity and culture within our community.

Mark McLaurin
August 11 2006, 11:02AM

G&D- How unfortunate that you chose to characterize me as "calling you names". I did no such thing- nor did I "demonize" or "personally attack" you (a ridiculous assertion as I dont even KNOW you). What I said was that what you said was elitist- I felt that then and I Feel it now. If you cant stand the heat associated with spirited dialogue perhaps an exit from the kitchen is in order !

I wish this community HAD enough resources for evaluation so that we even KNEW what worked and what didnt work for ALL of us, never mind being able to stratify by socio-economic indicators WITHIN the commmunity. Your "guess" about what would work with this "target" population is based in stereotypes and is, quite frankly, shameful coming from one of our own.

Mike-

Thanks for your kind words- Its the Philly kids with the boots on the ground who are the soldiers- Im just playing a supportive role and helping any way I can !!!

G&D
August 11 2006, 1:47PM

Mark.

More venom and attacks and then an abrupt invitation for me to leave the discourse. I haven't had this kind of dialogue directed towards me since my last run in with a primary school bully. I hope you learn to disagree without being disagreeable. Be blessed and please grow in grace. As I know you probably need it, I will allow you the last word.

To all others on both sides of this discussion.

I appreciate the thought you have put into this. I pray that we can rise above where some would take this and not lose focus that as we debate more than 50% of Black MSMs on the east coast are positive. This would indicate that current methods of prevention and outreach are not working. Lets work together as brothers to create new approaches.

Ashe

Donald
August 12 2006, 7:22AM

Thank you, Mark. And, you know, it really says something when the head of a Black gay magazine characterizes a campaign like this, a Black gay man adorned with crosshairs IN ANY CONTEXT, as "awesome" ... It says something about foundation of his magazine's message, no?